MIDIToLatheControl

[opcode66]

Recently there was discussion regarding control of a lathe via MIDI. Most of us use a DAW as our audio source for cutting. Almost all modern DAWs support MIDI output. When cutting a side the operator has to manually hit buttons at the correct times to do things like add track spacers, start the lead out groove and momentarily decrease the lines per inch in order to avoid echo. On a Neumann lathe these buttons are labeled Time, Fast and Echo. Sculy lathes have similar push buttons in it's control interface.

I've created a device to control three buttons via MIDI notes. The notes can be in any octave 0 - 9. C triggers the Time button. E triggers the Echo button. And, F triggers the Fast button. By adding a MIDI track to a cutting project and inserting C, E and F notes you can automate the entire cutting procedure using my device. I incorporated relays so the device is 100% electrically disconnected from the lathe. Using transistors would have required me to share a ground which I did not want to do.

Here are some pictures. I will be installing the device into my pitch box tonight. Video of it in use will follow soon.

I will be offering these units for sale on my site http://www.deepgroovesmastering.com

[andybee]

good work !!!
I had the same idea, but never the time to realise...
for example, soundforge can make midi-markers, so easy to control
the lathe...
like to see you box in action!!!

[opcode66]

I shot a quick demonstration video last night. It shows the Echo and Time triggers in action. I think you will get the idea from this short video. Though I am using mine with Time, Echo and Fast, this box can be used to trigger any three buttons on any lathe. From start to finish this project took me less than a week to complete. That includes programming, testing, designing the circuit and fabricating the final device.

The installation of this device took less then 15 minutes. If you are proficient with soldering it would be the same for you. Took the cover off the pitch box and set it down on a towel. The points you need to solder to are exposed and easily accessible. See the images below.

The demo video can be found here. http://youtu.be/UYmZGQpsaZY

Inside the Pitch Box


The Button Strip with Time and Fast on it.


The Echo button and also the +12V source for switching.


The final installation.


You will notice in the video that I have a strip of camera feeds on the right of my computer monitor. I added three webcams to my rig so I can see my Amp/Temp meters, BSB Meters and the cutterhead itself to see if chip has drpped. That way I only have to look at one place to see everything I need to see while cutting. It is very convenient and I highly recommend this to anyone else. I got the webcams for $9.99 a piece and wrote a custom application to pull the feeds into a vertical strip. I can do the same for anyone else as well for a nominal fee.

[dietrich10]

I assume it still lets you control from the pitch box if you so choose yes?

[opcode66]

Yes. Of course. This mod in no way affects the normal operation of the buttons on the Pitch box. Think of it as an alternate means of pressing each of the three buttons. They all still function as normal buttons. So, you could cut as usual with this box turned on or off.

[concretecowboy71]

Nice work.

Paul at Suma Recording has something set up in ProTools where he draws in the automation on a seperate track and it would spiral when it hit that spot on the track.

Is this similar to what you are doing?

[opcode66]

Precisely. If you watch the video you will see that I have a MIDI track in protools. I drew three notes:

1. E Note (any octave). Triggers the Echo button for my VMS70. This is for widening the spacing between the grooves at the bery beginning of a loud track to avoid groove echo. In protools I add an E Note at the beginning of the audio going to my cutterhead and extending as long as I want the Echo to be on for.

2. C Note (any octave). Triggers the Time button for my VMS70. This is for adding track spaces between tracks on a cut that has more than one track of audio. In protools I draw a C Note between each track. The lenght of the Time for the spiral is determined by the knob on the pitch box as usual.

3. F Note (any octave). Triggers the Fast button for my VMS70. This is for triggering the lead out groove at the end of the final track on a side.

Therefore I can completely automate a cut. I could cut two dubs exactly the same because the timings of the Echo/Fast/Time buttons would be exactly the same.

What is very nice is that now I can do a dry run (time out a side without the cutterhead engaged) of a side and not have to hit the buttons each time. Unattended if you will.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYmZGQpsaZY

[concretecowboy71]

That is very cool indeed. I appreciate the fact that people are out there integrating technology into these classic machines.

[opcode66]

This is just the tip of the iceberg. The next device to be showcased is an all in one speed/diameter box for VMS66/70. It will have an LCD screen and push button interface for selecting speed and size. It will connect to the lathe using a tuchel interface that has been pictured on this site preivously. The box could operate on its own or it could be switched via a desktop application or MIDI Sysex information.

Then the piece de resistance will be the all in one DAW/Lathe Automation/All Speed and Diameter Switchin/Pitch Computer solution. At first it will be for VMS66/70 units. But, I will be able to conform them to scully or other lathes.

[Aussie0zborn]

This is very neat. The lathe has a Tuchel rectangular conector for this purpose. The Neumann mastering consoles have a panel that replicates all the buttons on the left side of the pitch box and this is connected to the lathe via the multi-pin connector. So, just wondering why you opted for soldering?

[Nickou]

nice box !

[opcode66]

I don't currently have a spare male tuchel. I didn't want to mess with any existing ones. It literally took less than 15 minutes to install this way. And, for those who don't want to solder I could supply a ribbon cable with aligator clips on the end. You can simply clamp on to the contacts since they are large and very accessible pads.

I am quite good at soldering and have a fantastic solder/desolder stations. So, doing work like that doesn't phase me at all.

[opcode66]

Ok. I'm can be a total idiot sometimes. LOL!

Yes, I could have soldered into pins 0c (power), 2a (Fast), 2c (Echo), 3a (Time) on the tuchel I have my Modulation and Preview audio hooked into. That is the tuchel in the 301 slot on the SV66 unit. My bad... For some reason I thought the cosoles hooked into a different slot. I was confusing it with the slot for the Tape Remote.

I'm going to disconnect from the pitch box and connect at those pins on the 301 tuchel.

[Aussie0zborn]

Neat. Making it "plug and play" might give you some extra sales too.

Speaking of the tape remote, how about an option to start playback of the DAW on completion of the lead-in groove?

Good luck with it and keep at it.

[opcode66]

Speaking of the tape remote, how about an option to start playback of the DAW on completion of the lead-in groove?

I already planned on doing this. I'm going to add a MIDI Output jack to the box. Many DAWs will start playback if given a MIDI Start Message 0xFA on one if the MIDI Inputs that it is monitoring. For instance, Protools will work this way.

The AS 66-M Tape Remote card for the VMS systems sends signals for Start and Stop over SV-301 if plugged into M-DC slot. Or, will give signals over AS-162 if plugged into the M-AC slot.

My main issue here is that I do not have an AS 66-M card. Once I find one or make one I will implement the automated playback via MIDI Start Message to DAW using the impluses from the AS 66-M card.

So, there will be a couple different models for this device. One that is VMS specific with the Echo, Fast and Time button automation and the automated start of DAW playback. And, one that is general use and can contain up to 12 triggerable relays that can be connected to an electrical push buttons on any lathe.

I could also make a version with wire pairs that would have digitally controlled voltage (like a MIDI to CV Gate box) or current output. Though I'm not sure that would be very useful by itself. Any sort of customization is possible however.

[opcode66]

I revisited the installation. I removed the leads from my pitch box and soldered them on to SV-301. Works a treat!

I'm looking into sourcing an AS 66-M card right now for the DAW Start impulse. More to come. For now, here are some pics of the SV-301 install.

[opcode66]

Hey Trolls! As promised, here is a new video demonstrating the full potential of my MIDIToLatheControl box. In this video you will see:

1. Tape Remote Start impulse conversion to MIDI Machine Command (MMC) Play message. Thereby starting playback of my DAW via the AS 66-M card.

2. Automation of Echo button at the beginning of a track.

3. Automation of Time button between tracks.

4. Automation of Fast button to initiate the lead-out groove.

5. Me cutting a 12" 33.3 RPM Lacquer Dub for my own personal enjoyment.

6. A completely hands free process that is fully automated.

This box is a simple install. Anyone with soldering skills can integrate this device into their lathe with the same results. I am offering fully fabricated boxes and connector cables for sale via my web site http://www.deepgroovesmastering.com/store.aspx.

The Video is here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8iqogUridE

Enjoy! And, happy cutting!

Todd a.k.a. opcode66

[opcode66]

I've finally gotten around to fixing my AS66-M Tape Remote Card. The Start impulse worked, however, the Stop impulse was not functioning. I troubleshot the card, Stop now works. So, I connected it to an unused pair in my 10 wire ribbon cable going from SV301 to my MIDIToLatheAutomation box. The Stop relay on AS66-M is attached to SV301 pins 1b and 2b when the card is in the DC slot.

I programmed my chip to respond to the extra input on an unused pin. I wired one of the Stop relay wires to the chip with a pull up resistor, and the wire goes to ground. When my chip detects the relay being activated, it send out both a MIDI Stop message, as well as an MMC Stop Command. Everything works as expected!

Anytime Fast or Stop is triggered on the Lathe, playback of audio is stopped in my DAW. The Stop button on the pitch box now controls both the Lathe and audio playback. It is very nice....

[opcode66]

MIDIToLatheControlVST

I created a VST control to send MIDI out to my lathe automation box. I can now control the functions of the box via this handy on-screen interface in addition to sending out timed notes in a MIDI track.

[opcode66]

I rewrote the functionality of the VST control as a standalone desktop application. The VST didn't work in ProTools as it did in Ableton Live. Now, everthing is working as expected!