limit of vinylrecorder T560?

[marcy108]

hi all.
i bought vinyl recorder t560 1 year ago.
i'm trying to best transfer everyday.
i want same sound as a master.

but i can't get good treble.i guess it's 2K to 6K.
accordingly sound that i cut is so different from master.

if i raise up 2K-6K,sound get distortion.
so i must down treble against my will...

i upload file.

master
https://soundcloud.com/user105332958/master

record that i cut
https://soundcloud.com/user105332958/20150808-cut


but i guess this treble can be cut with Neumann or any other professional cutting machine.
so i believe this groove is possible.but i can't cut.

bypass souri's mixer.
use main unit.
use EQ on my DAW.
use new stylus.

is this limit of vinylrecorder T560?

Any advice would be most appreciated!

[markrob]

Hi,

I hope you don't expect this machine to equal the performance of a Neumann.

What size power amp are you using? Is this (or anything else in the audio chain) clipping when you boost the treble? Have you tried lowering the overall cutting level by several db's and applying the required treble boost. This will tell you if the head is the limit or the power amp. I suspect there will be trade off between cutting levels and high frequency performance.

Mark

[marcy108]

hi MARK.thank you for your reply.

>What size power amp are you using?
（4ohms）：380W+380W

>Is this (or anything else in the audio chain) clipping when you boost the treble?
this is my circuit.
DAW --(1)--> MAIN UNIT --(2)--> AMP --(3)--> CUTTERHEAD(4)
there is no clipping at (1)(2)(3).
i guess i can't check at (4).

>I suspect there will be trade off between cutting levels and high frequency performance.
i'm with you.
when i down overall volume.i can cut better treble.
but it's not best treble and the volume is too small.max -8db.
it's big problem...

>I hope you don't expect this machine to equal the performance of a Neumann.
do you know what is main difference between vinyl recorder and neumann?
i think NEUMANN have feedback cutterhead.but VR is dynamic one.

[Gus]

The Answer is Neumann lathe cost thousand $$$ more than souri's vinyl recorder.

[opcode66]

Souri makes a feedback style cutterhead as well.

The difference is that Neumann was making lathes and cutterheads for decades. They invested millions of dollars 60 plus years ago to develop their technology. That's a lot in today's money. They made one of the finest turnkey lathe systems ever.

Souri is one guy who maybe invested the equivalent of 50 to 100K USD into developing his system that he makes in-house. It's worth in parts is maybe about 1/3 to 1/4 of the cost of the machine. It is not machined to the level of accuracy or precision that a Neumann system is. It can't perform anywhere close to a Nuemann. The entire system weighs less than 100 pounds. A Neumann weighs just over 600.

That about sums it up in a cursory fashion.

[marcy108]

hi Gus and opcode66.
thank you for your opinion.

actually there is big difference in their cost.
it may can't help that i can't got professional sound from vinyl recorder.
i understand it little by little.

but other hand,it seems that some VR user who write in this forum got great quality with VR.
(i guess it have good treble and good volume)

they even couldn't have best treble and volume like record that make by NEUMANN?
or is there better way with VR for get best quality?

any help would be appreciated!
thanks.

[opcode66]

The VR will never sound like a Neumann. Not unless you hang an Neumann SX74 cutterhead on it and use a SAL amp rack. LOL

However, my cutterhead will fit on a VR. You can totally ditch the entire cutting chain and use my head instead with a simple preamp and your own amplifier. Flo's Caruso cutterhead will also fit on a VR. That is my recommendation.

[marcy108]

opcode66 thank you for your great answer.

i hope your cutterhead.
can i try to get it?

and now, is CARUSO averrable?
it seems the cutterhead doesn't exist in shop...
http://vinylike.de/index.php/caruso/

[Gus]

1. Is your cutterhead diamond in good shape?
a worn needle can distort the sound and limit to transfer the high frequencies on disc

2. Try to cut a commercial song of the reel to reel years 80's or early 90's and listen how it sounds


3. Don't forget the material limits , i mean the Bayer PVC who uses souri's vinyl recorder

[marcy108]

>1. Is your cutterhead diamond in good shape?
>a worn needle can distort the sound and limit to transfer the high frequencies on disc
yes.i use new stylus.
and i already have experience that it got distortion with worn needle.

>2. Try to cut a commercial song of the reel to reel years 80's or early 90's and listen how it sounds
i have cut Norah Jones 6 month ago.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrhJN1e8OHs

the sound is almost no problem.it don't have distortion.
but little not enough treble.much bass.
but if i lower bass,balance of sound be odd.

>3. Don't forget the material limits , i mean the Bayer PVC who uses souri's vinyl recorder
what mean material limits?
i use MYSHANK blank.

thank you.

[Gus]

[quote="marcy108"]>1. Is your cutterhead diamond in good shape?
>a worn needle can distort the sound and limit to transfer the high frequencies on disc
yes.i use new stylus.
and i already have experience that it got distortion with worn needle.

>2. Try to cut a commercial song of the reel to reel years 80's or early 90's and listen how it sounds
i have cut Norah Jones 6 month ago.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrhJN1e8OHs

the sound is almost no problem.it don't have distortion.
but little not enough treble.much bass.
but if i lower bass,balance of sound be odd.

>3. Don't forget the material limits , i mean the Bayer PVC who uses souri's vinyl recorder
what mean material limits?
i use MYSHANK blank.

try to cut something like your own master with fuzz guitars for example jesus & mary chain or my bloody valentine, if it sounds good then i think the problem is with your mix don't forget the golden years of vinyl was before the digital mastering comes in production (my opinion)

i think myshank blanks and souri's blanks are the same material and for sure is not the same as Apollo master discs for neumann lathes

Good Luck

[The Shank]

i think myshank blanks and souri's blanks are the same material...

No.

[studiorp]

What's the difference ?

[marcy108]

>Gus
thank you good picture.i will try.but i don't know well about "jesus & mary chain" and "my bloody valentine".
if you can tell me,please let me know your recommended their song.

Apollo's blank is only Lacquer in my recognition.
souri's one and myshank one both are PVC.
but i guess myshank one is softer than souri's.
so stylus can get long life.

incidentally i also use myshank stylus.

i still need any advice for get best treble and volume.
any help would be appreciated! thank you.

[The Shank]

>Gus
thank you good picture.i will try.but i don't know well about "jesus & mary chain" and "my bloody valentine".
if you can tell me,please let me know your recommended their song.

Apollo's blank is only Lacquer in my recognition.
souri's one and myshank one both are PVC.
but i guess myshank one is softer than souri's.
so stylus can get long life.

incidentally i also use myshank stylus.

i still need any advice for get best treble and volume.
any help would be appreciated! thank you.

Maybe try to you the treble on the main unit?

[marcy108]

hi The Shank.
thank you for your reply.

yes i'm trying with souri's main unit.
does main unit have any problem?

[The Shank]

hi The Shank.
thank you for your reply.

yes i'm trying with souri's main unit.
does main unit have any problem?

I don't know from here if you have any hardware problem...

Every VR head have a different sound, you have to calibrate the system. Maybe it comes from the overhead that has moved and need to be setup
again
It can be so much reason....

[marcy108]

>Every VR head have a different sound
oh..i'm surprised...

>you have to calibrate the system. Maybe it comes from the overhead that has moved and need to be setup again
>It can be so much reason....
this is photo of my main unit.
attenuator that dial of back of main unit set 12 o'clock.
i bypass "souri's mixer" and "optimizer" and "monitor switcher".

[marcy108]

this is my setting of main unit.

[tragwag]

I've found the high end to be quite touchy on my VR cutter head as well.
I've heard other VR cuts that are much louder and clearer.
My head distorts anything above about 2 kHz at a volume of around -1 to -2 dB (ref +4 dbu)
It's just as good as it gets at the moment, when available there will be other cutter head options (bladerunner, caruso, etc)