Hi everyone!
Here in the lathetrolls.com many topics are about the restoration of ready made devices,setup tips or other questions.
I am going to create a record cutting machine from scratch. So nothing is ready made. Only there are screws,nuts,bolts,metal platters,rods wich are obtained.
The motor,the electronics and meters are factory made only.
Let share our experiences between us if somebody tried the similar.
Cheers!
Gabriel from Hungary
From scratch
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trailerparkjesus
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Re: From scratch
there are "from scratch" projects
sillitoe, zez (might be taken down), todds mariana lathe (he is on FB) among lots of others. Search search search
sillitoe, zez (might be taken down), todds mariana lathe (he is on FB) among lots of others. Search search search
Re: From scratch
Hi Guys!
As I did wrote in my previous post I am planned to build a record cutting lathe from scratch. Now I did begun.
First of all I ordered some main parts wich are industry produced. For example among them is the main motor, the linear rail movement by TBI Motion Company and some screws from the local hardware store. The two ball bearings are from the Maedler Germany. Obtained 12 mm thick textile reinforced bakelite boards for making the platter, the locknut-box assembly and the pulley wheels of the motor. I had a very good quality geared motor (lying around) for the groove control. Here are some pictures of the beginning. Now there are ready the locknut box (copy of a Presto system),the main axle with the subplatter,the handwheel for the lead out groove, and the one way bearing assembly for making possible the leadout mechanism to work.
More pictures are coming soon!
Have a nice day!
As I did wrote in my previous post I am planned to build a record cutting lathe from scratch. Now I did begun.
First of all I ordered some main parts wich are industry produced. For example among them is the main motor, the linear rail movement by TBI Motion Company and some screws from the local hardware store. The two ball bearings are from the Maedler Germany. Obtained 12 mm thick textile reinforced bakelite boards for making the platter, the locknut-box assembly and the pulley wheels of the motor. I had a very good quality geared motor (lying around) for the groove control. Here are some pictures of the beginning. Now there are ready the locknut box (copy of a Presto system),the main axle with the subplatter,the handwheel for the lead out groove, and the one way bearing assembly for making possible the leadout mechanism to work.
More pictures are coming soon!
Have a nice day!
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Re: From scratch
Hi guys!
Here are some pictures about the progress of my lathe. From scratch...
The swingarm itself: Assembled locknut and swingarm unit: The fully assembled unit with the bearings,and the groove control handwheel:
Coming soon....
Here are some pictures about the progress of my lathe. From scratch...
The swingarm itself: Assembled locknut and swingarm unit: The fully assembled unit with the bearings,and the groove control handwheel:
Coming soon....
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Re: From scratch
Hi Guys!
As I promised pictures are coming about my progress of record lathe building from scratch:
Here are photos about the finished cutterhead-rail bridge and the measuring scale,
The finished bridge:
In the backgroud here is the "four legged vice-mechanic"
The scale detail:
As I promised pictures are coming about my progress of record lathe building from scratch:
Here are photos about the finished cutterhead-rail bridge and the measuring scale,
The finished bridge:
In the backgroud here is the "four legged vice-mechanic"
The scale detail:
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Re: From scratch
Nice work! well done it looks great so far, love it
Re: From scratch
Hi fonogabor,
I am Absolutley Loving this Lathe Build. Great Work!!
And I can't wait to see more!! I love the choice of material for the Carriage is it Tufnol?? Or Paxolin?? (Tufnol is Fabric and Resin, Whereas Paxolin Tends to be Paper and Resin, It's not actually Bakelite as we know it, unless that is its trade name in Hungary?? ) Ought you not perhaps move the thread to the Experimenters and Innovators Section?? 
The thread would probably get more well deservered views. 
And of course with views come Questions and Suggestions from other Forum Members. 
A question of my own :- What drive motor will you be using for the Leadscrew?? Will the Leadscrew be driven by a Toothed Type Timing Belt and Toothed Pulleys, or a simpler Polyurethane Round Belt and U Section Pulley?? How will you Scroll out with the Handwheel if the Overhead Drive Motor is connected?? Is it driving through a Friction Clutch?? I ask because I encountered this same problem, and fitted a friction clutch to the Overhead I intend using with my own Build. Best Regards Soulbear 
I am Absolutley Loving this Lathe Build. Great Work!!
And I can't wait to see more!! I love the choice of material for the Carriage is it Tufnol?? Or Paxolin?? (Tufnol is Fabric and Resin, Whereas Paxolin Tends to be Paper and Resin, It's not actually Bakelite as we know it, unless that is its trade name in Hungary?? ) Ought you not perhaps move the thread to the Experimenters and Innovators Section?? The thread would probably get more well deservered views. And of course with views come Questions and Suggestions from other Forum Members. A question of my own :- What drive motor will you be using for the Leadscrew?? Will the Leadscrew be driven by a Toothed Type Timing Belt and Toothed Pulleys, or a simpler Polyurethane Round Belt and U Section Pulley?? How will you Scroll out with the Handwheel if the Overhead Drive Motor is connected?? Is it driving through a Friction Clutch?? I ask because I encountered this same problem, and fitted a friction clutch to the Overhead I intend using with my own Build. Best Regards Soulbear Re: From scratch
Hi Soulbear!
Thank you for your message! Sorry I am read your messages in reverse order. So this is why my answer a little incoherent.
Now I try to answer your questions:
The material of the bridge is "Tufnol" In Hungary it is called "Textile-Bakelite"(resin and textile). I love this substance because it is hard,durable but more easier to work on.It is excelently gluable with epoxy adhesives. So nice thing! Here after the machining works I did painted them with some spraypaint.
The driving of the leadscrew I plan to do with a geared DC motor wich is regulated with its own power supply. It means that the R/mm values are freely adjustable.
As I did wrote in my previous message I use a one way bearing for the leadscrew "independencing"
The pulley and the belt I thought about a plain round polyurethane one.... but I don't know will it work well....?
Soulbear, please give me an information(if you know): how much is the distance in between the central and the drive pin on Presto record lathes.
Thank you ! Best regards!
Gabriel
Thank you for your message! Sorry I am read your messages in reverse order. So this is why my answer a little incoherent.
Now I try to answer your questions:
The material of the bridge is "Tufnol" In Hungary it is called "Textile-Bakelite"(resin and textile). I love this substance because it is hard,durable but more easier to work on.It is excelently gluable with epoxy adhesives. So nice thing! Here after the machining works I did painted them with some spraypaint.
The driving of the leadscrew I plan to do with a geared DC motor wich is regulated with its own power supply. It means that the R/mm values are freely adjustable.
As I did wrote in my previous message I use a one way bearing for the leadscrew "independencing"
The pulley and the belt I thought about a plain round polyurethane one.... but I don't know will it work well....?
Soulbear, please give me an information(if you know): how much is the distance in between the central and the drive pin on Presto record lathes.
Thank you ! Best regards!
Gabriel
Re: From scratch
Hi Gabi,
Thank you for the update, I think I now know from what you say here, that you intend using what are called here in the UK and elsewhere a "Sprag Clutch or Sprag Bearing" to allow the Hand Cranking whilst having the Gearmotor Drive Train to your Overhead Leadscrew connected. Nice one, I think its a great idea, I wished I had thought about that before going down the "Friction Clutch Route" Quite effective and considerably less expensive!! Oh well, too late this time for my MSS Overhead Modification, but maybe I could use a similar idea on the next Build.
In some of my repair/rebuilds I've used these little GearMotors and PWM Controller and Displays. The display shows the Duty Cycle of the PWM Controller as a % and I have used the Display and Stopwatch to create a Cutting Time Chart, All good fun!! I've also used Polyurethene Belt instead of Timing Belts and just make the belt to the required Length, weld jointing the belt with a Soldering Iron modified with an Rectangular Aluminium Block Attached to the Tip.
Thank you for the update, I think I now know from what you say here, that you intend using what are called here in the UK and elsewhere a "Sprag Clutch or Sprag Bearing" to allow the Hand Cranking whilst having the Gearmotor Drive Train to your Overhead Leadscrew connected. Nice one, I think its a great idea, I wished I had thought about that before going down the "Friction Clutch Route" Quite effective and considerably less expensive!! Oh well, too late this time for my MSS Overhead Modification, but maybe I could use a similar idea on the next Build.
In some of my repair/rebuilds I've used these little GearMotors and PWM Controller and Displays. The display shows the Duty Cycle of the PWM Controller as a % and I have used the Display and Stopwatch to create a Cutting Time Chart, All good fun!! I've also used Polyurethene Belt instead of Timing Belts and just make the belt to the required Length, weld jointing the belt with a Soldering Iron modified with an Rectangular Aluminium Block Attached to the Tip.You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Last edited by Soulbear on Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Re: From scratch
Make your own Poly Belt Its very easy, just measure the length you require and then shorten this length by 10% to allow for the Tension of the drive belt
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Re: From scratch
The main bearing is under construction...Pictures are coming soon....
Re: From scratch
Hi Lathetrolls!
On my promise now I show the pictures about the construction and structure of the main (platter) bearing.
Today I did finished it and tomorrow I go to assemble this part completely.
The components are:
The subplatter and its shaft
The cross-shaped fixture ( I made it from steel by welding)
Upper ball bearing with its steel housing and the adapting element
Distance holder
Lower ball bearing also with its adapter and housing
Machine-grease retaining rings
Solitary base-ball
Adjuster screw
Four long screws holding all together.
The basic concept. One layer of the structure. Adding more layers and gluing together All of the components of the main bearing in the order of assembly. Here is the experimentally preassembled workpiece. Bearings adjuster screw .
On my promise now I show the pictures about the construction and structure of the main (platter) bearing.
Today I did finished it and tomorrow I go to assemble this part completely.
The components are:
The subplatter and its shaft
The cross-shaped fixture ( I made it from steel by welding)
Upper ball bearing with its steel housing and the adapting element
Distance holder
Lower ball bearing also with its adapter and housing
Machine-grease retaining rings
Solitary base-ball
Adjuster screw
Four long screws holding all together.
The basic concept. One layer of the structure. Adding more layers and gluing together All of the components of the main bearing in the order of assembly. Here is the experimentally preassembled workpiece. Bearings adjuster screw .
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Re: From scratch
Hi Guys!
Here are some pictures about my machine's building advance.
The center of the platter. The four screws are for the leveling the platter.
The platter and the main bearing together
Rubber damping rings for the quieter operation and adjustability:
The finished platter is rotating....
Here are some pictures about my machine's building advance.
The center of the platter. The four screws are for the leveling the platter.
The platter and the main bearing together
Rubber damping rings for the quieter operation and adjustability:
The finished platter is rotating....
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Re: From scratch
This is really impressive, nice work! Can't wait to see the finished product and see what you do with it.
Re: From scratch
Dear Friend!
Thank you for your appreciation!
What I am doing with it? Record cutting!
(Maybe some people thought about some pottery but they are mistaking....
Have a nice day!
Thank you for your appreciation!
What I am doing with it? Record cutting!
(Maybe some people thought about some pottery
but they are mistaking.... Have a nice day!
Re: From scratch
Hello Guys!
Now during creation of my " from scratch lathe" I did faced with a problem.
I would be glad if somebody could give me some advice.
In my project the next step is the main (platter) motor assembly. BUT! I cannot to obtain one.
The ideal candidate must be:
80-100W power
Quiet
Rotating clockwise
Slower speed ( maximum 1450 RPM)
Operating on 230V 50-60 Hz
I was trying with a 100W fan motor. It was 1450 RPM,but CCW and the noise level is 60 dB. I did reassembled its stator in reverse so the rotation also became inverted. But the noise problem was remaining....60 dB is intolerably loud for the recording application IMHO. The conventional record player's motors are quiet but they has not enough power for the record cutting purpose... So I don't know how to go on....
What could I do to solve this problem?
Thanks for every advice!
Gabriel
Now during creation of my " from scratch lathe" I did faced with a problem.
I would be glad if somebody could give me some advice.
In my project the next step is the main (platter) motor assembly. BUT! I cannot to obtain one.
The ideal candidate must be:
80-100W power
Quiet
Rotating clockwise
Slower speed ( maximum 1450 RPM)
Operating on 230V 50-60 Hz
I was trying with a 100W fan motor. It was 1450 RPM,but CCW and the noise level is 60 dB. I did reassembled its stator in reverse so the rotation also became inverted. But the noise problem was remaining....60 dB is intolerably loud for the recording application IMHO. The conventional record player's motors are quiet but they has not enough power for the record cutting purpose... So I don't know how to go on....
What could I do to solve this problem?
Thanks for every advice!
Gabriel
Re: From scratch
Hi,
We need more information in order to help.
How are you measuring the motor noise? Is this recovered from the playback of a silent groove cut?
60dB relative to what?? By itself, that number is meaningless.
What is the noise spectrum? E.g. is it AC mains related, rotational noise, random, etc?
How is the motor mounted, coupled, and isolated from the platter? Given the 1400+ RPM of the motor, the platter direct driven, right?
Mark
We need more information in order to help.
How are you measuring the motor noise? Is this recovered from the playback of a silent groove cut?
60dB relative to what?? By itself, that number is meaningless.
What is the noise spectrum? E.g. is it AC mains related, rotational noise, random, etc?
How is the motor mounted, coupled, and isolated from the platter? Given the 1400+ RPM of the motor, the platter direct driven, right?
Mark
Re: From scratch
Hi Markrob!
I am always wellcome any advice or recommendation!
The motor noise I did measured with an Android app. on my phone.
The motor was lying on my work table with some damping material under it..
This motor was out of the future equipment-so not mounted in,.
This damping was intended to simulate the rubber blocks-as the motor would be fitted in the machine.
The zero dB was referenced to the absolute silence.
The 60 dB reading I have got measuring the motor noise in the air- 10 cm from it.
The disturbing noise is similar to the 50 Hz AC mains frequency.When I switched off the power,it became clear that the noise is in conjunction with the AC magnetic field in the iron core of my motor because then I did heard only quiet bearing's noise only.
Have a nice day!
Gabriel
I am always wellcome any advice or recommendation!
The motor noise I did measured with an Android app. on my phone.
The motor was lying on my work table with some damping material under it..
This motor was out of the future equipment-so not mounted in,.
This damping was intended to simulate the rubber blocks-as the motor would be fitted in the machine.
The zero dB was referenced to the absolute silence.
The 60 dB reading I have got measuring the motor noise in the air- 10 cm from it.
The disturbing noise is similar to the 50 Hz AC mains frequency.When I switched off the power,it became clear that the noise is in conjunction with the AC magnetic field in the iron core of my motor because then I did heard only quiet bearing's noise only.
Have a nice day!
Gabriel
Re: From scratch
Hi,
I'm not sure that is the best way to evaluate the motor. It seems to me, you need to get it setup to drive the platter and cut silent grooves and then try different method(s) to isolate the motor vibration from the platter. For example, if you hold the motor in your hands and run the same test, does that reduce the acoustic sound radiated into the air? If so, you can see how decoupling the motor vibration from the environment can be effective. Perhaps you are correct, that this is a bad choice, but I would not jump to that conclusion until you do some more work. Other factors to consider are how steady is the speed (e.g. wow and flutter). How easy is it to adjust or control (e.g. PWM, phase control, or open loop via a VFD or a simple Variac).
Mark
I'm not sure that is the best way to evaluate the motor. It seems to me, you need to get it setup to drive the platter and cut silent grooves and then try different method(s) to isolate the motor vibration from the platter. For example, if you hold the motor in your hands and run the same test, does that reduce the acoustic sound radiated into the air? If so, you can see how decoupling the motor vibration from the environment can be effective. Perhaps you are correct, that this is a bad choice, but I would not jump to that conclusion until you do some more work. Other factors to consider are how steady is the speed (e.g. wow and flutter). How easy is it to adjust or control (e.g. PWM, phase control, or open loop via a VFD or a simple Variac).
Mark
Re: From scratch
Dear Mark!
Thank you very much for your help. I did switched from this asynchronic AC induction motor to the microstep driven stepper(NEMA 23 and a driver). This device was used in the DIY lathes by some people here in "lathetrolls.com".
Because the stepper motor is acts here as a synchronous one it can hold its speed independently of the loads. About the problems of vibration I did saw some info in the YouTube video of Field Norman. He is a nice guy with a broad horizon of knowledge. If you are interested I would like to recommend to see his videos...
Have a nice day!
Gabriel
Thank you very much for your help. I did switched from this asynchronic AC induction motor to the microstep driven stepper(NEMA 23 and a driver). This device was used in the DIY lathes by some people here in "lathetrolls.com".
Because the stepper motor is acts here as a synchronous one it can hold its speed independently of the loads. About the problems of vibration I did saw some info in the YouTube video of Field Norman. He is a nice guy with a broad horizon of knowledge. If you are interested I would like to recommend to see his videos...
Have a nice day!
Gabriel