Best stereo cutterhead for my application

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Bill Hughes
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Best stereo cutterhead for my application

Post: # 27551Unread post Bill Hughes
Wed Oct 30, 2013 1:02 am

I was a mastering engineer 45 years ago. I ran triangle recording in Rahway N.J. At that time I used a Fairchild 642 system on a Scully Lathe. I had a Fairchild 760, and Fairchild Conax. If I were to get back into the business since retirement, I would still go with a Scully, but what is todays best Stereo head?

By best, repairability, frequency response, reliability. I really want performance to at least 22 khz.

I have been an analog circuit design engineer specializing in audio power amplifiers, especially class "D"

Also, is there any money in doing laquer mastering in these times.

Bill

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petermontg
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Re: Best stereo cutterhead for my application

Post: # 27554Unread post petermontg
Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:24 am

Big money? Depends how hard you want to work really.

The Scully platter is not as flat as the platter on Neumann so you would need an advance ball on the head, reason you don't see many SX74 on a Scully. Westrex 3DII has the advance ball and go to head for Scully. If you can sort a Neumann platter all the better (Best of luck by the way) for SX74 you would also need the suspension for the head.

There is a mongrel Scully lathe out there that has such a set up.
Peter Montgomery
+353(0)894926271
peter(at)petermontgomerymastering.com

Stereo cutter head wanted. Send email or smoke signals.

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concretecowboy71
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Re: Best stereo cutterhead for my application

Post: # 27568Unread post concretecowboy71
Thu Oct 31, 2013 12:40 pm

Do you own a scully already?

I would vote for an SX68. Great head, less money.

But you would have to work out the suspension.

Is there money to be made? Yes, but you have to work your ass off to get it. I cut about 1500 sides per year, maybe more and I make a living. Be ready for long hours, equipment breakdowns and a generation of customers that need to be re educated about vinyl.

Beats working for the man!
Cutting Masters in Bristol,Virginia, USA
Well Made Music / Gotta Groove Records

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opcode66
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Re: Best stereo cutterhead for my application

Post: # 27569Unread post opcode66
Thu Oct 31, 2013 3:42 pm

It should be clearly stated that unless you still have contacts in the industry willing to send work your way, just having a professional stereo lathe in top condition is no guarantee of work.

What Clint didn't mention is that he has a relationship with at least one pressing plant. When people contact the plant for a pressing, they send the audio to Clint. Pretty sweet deal. :wink:

Without a deal like this with a pressing plant, distributor or large studio then you are on your own. It is enough work to keep the gear in top condition and get the cuts done. Trying to do marketing on top of all of that is a lot of work. Everyone cuts for about the same amount of money. So, unless you're willing to seriously undercut your value, price isn't a factor for potential clients.

If people have already done a record (band, individual producer, studio, distributor) and they liked it, then they have ZERO motivation to change to a new cutter. You can't even get them to send over a test cut so you can demonstrate your abilities. Breaking into this market is extremely difficult. That is the absolute truth of the matter. Doesn't matter how good your gear is, how well you can cut, what your background or experience is. If someone is comfortable with their cutter and the price is all the same, what is the motivation to go elsewhere. There isn't any.

So, my advice is this: Have serious consideration about where your revenue stream will be coming from before you start planning about the technology you'll employ to do the work. If you know you can get a good stream of cuts through the door then go for it! If you end up with any Neumann electronics (other than a cutterhead) I can help you with servicing.
Cutting, Inventing & Innovating
Groove Graphics, VMS Halfnuts, MIDI Automation, Professional Stereo Feedback Cutterheads, and Pesto 1-D Cutterhead Clones
Cutterhead Repair: Recoiling, Cleaning, Cloning of Screws, Dampers & More
http://mantra.audio

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concretecowboy71
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Re: Best stereo cutterhead for my application

Post: # 27573Unread post concretecowboy71
Fri Nov 01, 2013 2:45 pm

Yes, I do have an arrangement with Gotta Groove here in Cleveland. It was the only way I could make my business plan work in a realistic way. If I had to spend my time doing extra marketing, day to day communication with bands and follow up to actually get paid, I would not have much time to cut records.

We work very hard to make our clients happy and of course I want to make the end client not want to switch services either. We get a lot of repeat business this way. In the end it is a team effort and I think that makes it easier than trying to go it alone.
Cutting Masters in Bristol,Virginia, USA
Well Made Music / Gotta Groove Records

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boogievan
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Re: Best stereo cutterhead for my application

Post: # 27575Unread post boogievan
Sat Nov 02, 2013 1:46 am

Hi Bill, if you want to be flat up to 22k, there are only two choices: Ortofon DSS series and unobtainable JVC CH-90. Big wigs say, even with the SX-74, their best sound is with the Ortofon GO741 amps. No other cutting system is truly hi fi. Neumann dives at 16 kHz. Westrex at 12 kHz. This is not a diss. It's a fact. Also, there's no reason you need to do actual hi fi. Most records are cut with Westrex or Neumann and most records sound fine. Symphonic spectral response sounds way better than today's schlock pop, anyway. Also there is a global shortage of available Helium. Only magicians and clowns are allowed to refill these days, since welders and cutters are deemed unworthy. Good luck finding [He]. It can be found, but you'll need luck. Therefore, a Westrex 3D is probably the best bet for the future, since gas cooling is closer to optional with that cutter than with any other of good response. If you want hi fi, make a CD. Heck, make a DVD-A. If you want good sound, use a 3D and some tube amps. Len Horowitz is still your go-to guy for real talk. By the way, a Scully turntable is fearfully wrought and should be ruler flat with runout around +/- 1 mil after proper setup. You can float a Westrex. You can float a Haeco. It's all in Larry Boden's cutting literature compendium, Basic Disc Mastering (2nd edition). The trick is removing the tail piece (to lighten the load), moving the counter spring forward (to increase its lifting power (see: Archimedes)), and to choose a spring with ideal oscillation modes. Belt drive is best for least rumble and to keep external flux lines far from the cutter. Quartz locked servo belt drives exist.

servus,
boogie

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Dub Bull
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Re: Best stereo cutterhead for my application

Post: # 27577Unread post Dub Bull
Sat Nov 02, 2013 9:41 pm

Bill, what Tim E. is saying about the Neumann response is true for the -68 when used with the -66 and earlier. However, the SX-74 when used with the SAL-74B is able to deliver up to 20 kHz +/- 1 dB, according to Larry's book. Also, if the -68 is used with something called the CA-72, which Neumann was at least planning, or maybe did build, you could have 20 kHz. But it's true that the -74 is only designed to do CD4 at half-speed. The Ortofon DSS and JVC CH-90 are special cutters. The realized that only the rocking bridge with the very low mass build could get above 20 kHz with serviceable signal strength. Of course, this doesn't mean the sound isn't improved theoretically for stereo cuts. The impulse response of infrasonic audio benefits greatly from the higher frequency capability. The phase response of the -68 when used with even the planned CA-72 is not pretty at highest frequencies stereo.

All major cutters (Haeco, Westrex, Neumann, Ortofon, JVC, and the 2015 FloKa Caruso that I know we're all going to love) are good. In a similar way to how there's no single knife that out-cuts them all, there's room for many designs in the troll's cutting arsenal. The long sword is great if you can keep your opponent at the necessary distance for slaying. However, only the dagger can save your skin if the opponent has entered the effective radius of the long sword's swing. Bruce Lee had a lethal 2" punch. You do the math.

King Tubby's mono dub cuts are as good as you'll ever really need. One sound. One love. One drive. One loudspeaker. That is, the hardest part is cutting a side that's worth hearing twice. (;


- Father Jose'

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philbrown
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Re: Best stereo cutterhead for my application

Post: # 28205Unread post philbrown
Mon Dec 23, 2013 10:26 pm

petermontg wrote:Big money? Depends how hard you want to work really.

The Scully platter is not as flat as the platter on Neumann so you would need an advance ball on the head, reason you don't see many SX74 on a Scully. Westrex 3DII has the advance ball and go to head for Scully. If you can sort a Neumann platter all the better (Best of luck by the way) for SX74 you would also need the suspension for the head.

There is a mongrel Scully lathe out there that has such a set up.

It's been done several times. Doug Sax had one. I have a friend with one.

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