Carriage Lubrication -- VMS-70

[concretecowboy71]

Recently, I have been getting a defect in my cuts that looks like two grooves superimposed on each other. You can physically see it during the cut as a big, deep groove.

At first I thought it might be a pitch and depth problem, but after using different source material, I noticed that the issue happened in the same place. To me this pointed towards something mechanical.

I talked to Al this morning and he suggested cleaning and lubricating the carriage and bearings.

I have made it through one job so far without issue and hope I have this licked.

Does anybody have experience with this problem? What kinda of oil do you use? How much oil do you use?

As always, thanks!

[drdub]

we had the same problem...

cleaned the carriage, and put more lubrication on it. the carriage tends
to get dusty. this can cause all kinds of strange behavior like:
- overcutting
- noise in the runnout grooves, when the carriage has to move fast
- grooves not at the supposed distance from each other

if grooves are strange at the same place, its most likely a mechanical problem

second thing are the two bearings. i removed, and cleaned them - problem gone.

i think the more important thing is a clean and well lubricated carriage to keep things run smoothly

cheers
mex

[concretecowboy71]

Yes, thank you Dr Dub and also Dietrich who chimed in with a helpful email.

I cleaned the carriage and lubricated with light machine oil.

Blew compressed air under and around the carriage.

Removed the bearing cover and inspected.

Lubricated the bearings.

Have been cutting all night with no return of the problem.

Thank Goodness!

[gold]

It should be a light film of oil on the carriage rail top and also underneath where the carriage meets the rail. I put a couple of drops right behind the carriage. Then slowly work the carriage back until the oil is sucked underneath. The object is to not have to remove any oil once the carriage is all the way to the right. Then do the front of the carriage.

The lead screw should be dry. You can use acetone with a lint free cloth to get the oil off. I periodically clean the lead screw with a dry piece of fiberglass strapping cut to a sharp point. It gets any gunk out of the crevices.

[concretecowboy71]

Thanks Paul!

Hopefully all this info will help some other poor soul down the line who is pulling their hair out like I was!

Once I got the carriage lubricated I realized how much the movement had deteriorated over time without even noticing.

I really like the idea for cleaning the lead screw.

[gold]

When I was starting out the same thing happened to me. I spent a few days chasing the pitch and depth system on my VMS62 Special. I finally gave up and called Al. He walked in, touched the slide, said "it's dry", put oil on it and left. I felt like an idiot.

There are so many little things to keep track of.

[drdub]

I felt like an idiot.

we do that alot !

[dietrich10]

Just did last cut until after xmas and after this post...good time to do the oil work as well.

my carriage gets some dirt build up+dryness this time of year as well with the forced air heat.

[tubefan]

Just a note, at least the manual recommends 2:1 mix high damping cylinder oil and Shell Tellus 29 for application to the ways under the carriage. The "Heissdampfzylinderoel" is around ISO 460 steam cylinder oil, the Shell Tellus 29 is more like an ISO 46 hydraulic oil.

This combo is a LOT thicker than a light machine oil. (Incidentally the ISO 46 is for various other bearings on the VMS66/70, and the ISO 460 is what is in the mechanical filter for the turntable platter).

[mossboss]

Singer Sewing machine oil obtained in any sewing shop has done the trick for many years
Alternative is All in one but that is second choice
Few drops every day before a cut does it
It never seems to go "hard" with temperature variations
I was told by an old timer that it contains whale oil and a bit of mineral oil
Ok whales!
It comes in a small tin with about 4 oz in it and it lasts for ever so I can deal with the whale oil bit
The other suggestions are all good to but after many years using the Singer stuff I am happy to report it is not necessary besides in the qty one needs to buy the stuff it will last 100 life times or will lubricate all the lathes ever made by any one and still have some left over
Cheers

[dietrich10]

Not the first time I've heard whale oil best for the carriage

[philbrown]

We used to use STP on our Scullys.
Phil Brown

[emorritt]

I've always been told to use mineral oil since it doesn't get sticky with age as machine oils tend to.