Ownership of Plates/masters

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piaptk
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Ownership of Plates/masters

Post: # 46481Unread post piaptk
Fri Mar 24, 2017 8:53 pm

For pressing plant owners:

If a client pays you to cut lacquer masters, make stampers, etc... do they not OWN those materials, to be returned to them upon request?

Can a pressing plant refuse to return your plates and release the masters out of spite because you want to take the repressing elsewhere?
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Jccc
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Re: Ownership of Plates/masters

Post: # 46503Unread post Jccc
Mon Mar 27, 2017 3:54 pm

I have that same question too.

I usually have gotton back my stampers when i would have aardvark mastering do the master and have it sent to united record pressing.
United would usually send the plates back withen a month or two after i have gotten my order.

But this time i went a different route and had Rainbo do everything.
And i sent them a message asking if they would ever mail my stampers back. They replied and said they usually hold onto them for possible represses.

I sent them a message saying i have no plans of repressing and that i should be able to own them since i paid for them.

I am still waiting for a reply.

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mossboss
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Re: Ownership of Plates/masters

Post: # 47203Unread post mossboss
Sat Jun 24, 2017 5:59 pm

This is a moot point without a clear cut answer, it depends what a plant considers they are doing so as to get your vinyl records
Are they providing you with a service or are they selling your goods
In the case of the job of making vinyl records it is a half and half scenario
Need to first clarify a point. Not sure what the term masters as posted refers to
If it is masters with your material on it is never owned by a plant if you have submitted it to them via any means either physical of electronic. Don't expect it back as it is the case plants will always say don't send us your originals send us a copy it is hard to keep track and be responsible to return them, regardless, it is never owned by the plant.
If it is master as in metal work from a lacquer or a DMM cut read on
Let me lay out some scenarios which most people out there, even though they had many records pressed may not be aware
I will preempt the scenario by stating
You may need to be made aware that you pay for the service up to the point that the plant can get you the physical goods that is records.
And why is that people can fairly ask, well,
What is following is not hypothetical, it is a frequent occurrence
You want to release some records on vinyl so you go out get some quotes they come in you decide where to go.
So now you have chosen a plant or a broker it does not matter, your job will finish up in a plant somewhere
Let's say it is a one stop shop offering you the whole process
In other words you give them your files they give you finished records
The prices you have been given would most likely be broken down to the various components of your job
Cutting, galvanics, labels jackets inner bags records inserts stickers shrink wrapping packaging etc
So you proceed with placing your order than the process starts
The steps are known to most but let's cover them, cut, metal work, pressing, in the meantime the printers are busy with the paper parts of the job labels jackets inserts etc when it is all together the job gets packed than goes out to the client
Easy breezey just like having a cup of coffe. Ha
First up is the cutting of the job
1. The cutting guy takes the music files you have submitted, proceeds in checking them out he finds all sorts of little issues which he has to deal with, he does what he has to do, if it is going to alter the material beyond what's submitted he stops the job may send the client a note or speak to the mastering guy in an attempt to sort it out. It gets sorted
Starts cutting
There is an out of phase bit which he misses, the mastering guy also missed, looses his track ruins the lacquer starts again after correcting it
Keep in mind you are to supply mastered for vinyl files Mmmmm
So what we have is material down the drain a lacquer or two plus his time
The cutting job ultimately gets done of it goes to plating stampers come out go on the press for test pressings, they sound like crap why?
Start looking find the culprit correct it start again may be the cut may be the plating may be the press whatever it is it gets sorted fixed than when satisfactory test pressings go out
It could require a complete recut a new set of stampers mothers may be not up to scratch another set of negatives than mothers than back on the press
All seems fine off it goes to the client
Are you aware that it is not infrequent, you may be told may be not, regardless
Have you ever been asked to pay for any of the above?
The answer would be a blatant NO
2. Everything is perfect all goes smoothly the resulting test pressings are up to standard out go the test pressings approval is given for production to proceed
Stamper gets damaged on the press, the. Automation picked up a bit of stray PVC or by some inclusion in the compound a bit of metal a bit of hard plastic a bit of string from the bag that was not carefully opened by some guy productions stops, another job goes on about an hour wasted new stampers are ordered the stampers arrive back on to the press the job is done packed goes out everyone is happy apart from the fact if it was a 150-300 order they made nothing on the job even subsidised it
Did they ask the client to cover any of the above? NO
3. Absolutely a clean run no issues with anything whatsoever job gets done no hiccups at all, smooth sailing all the way, every one is happy
Read the above a few times than decide the question for yourselves
As I said it is a moot point,
There was a simple answer back in the days (What's on the grove belongs to the client, what it is on belongs to the plant)
I am not answering the question I am providing some scenarios, there are many others as well which are frequent events in any pressing plant it does not matter where it is located.
Best
Chris

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