VinylRecorder Picture Discs Question

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Ben
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VinylRecorder Picture Discs Question

Post: # 45711Unread post Ben
Mon Jan 23, 2017 11:53 am

Hey Guys,
Hope you're doing great,
When I bought my VR a couple of years ago I also bought his lamitator and kit to do picture disc, since then I never really tried it until now.

I'm kind of rusted with that... I already have his 1mm discs that are to cut on one side and sticky on on the other side to join to another one.

My question #1 is, is there a special type of paper to use? because from what I understand.... it's when you stick the 2 discs together it's the paper that hold everything.
and should I leave a little edge with no paper so the outer edge can stick disc to disc?

My second #2, since I have the laminator, I don't really recall how to use this, I guess I need to remove the plastic on the disc.... stick my designed on it.... put the second disc and then put it in the laminator? is that it?

Thanks guys and all the best for 2017 starting
Ben

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Ben
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Re: Picture Discs Question

Post: # 45868Unread post Ben
Mon Jan 30, 2017 1:06 pm

Not a really popular subject I see.... :shock:
haha!

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TheCrates
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Re: Picture Discs Question

Post: # 45871Unread post TheCrates
Mon Jan 30, 2017 1:27 pm

My buddy tim of vinyl-recording has a vacuum printing table. he prints each inner side (its not transparent, you cant look through the print) and glue it together. its easy that way because you dont see any bubbles of the glue between, in case there are any.

i guess its the same principle like your laminator kit. im pretty sure it doesnt matter which kind of paper you use as long you get the bubbles out so it look proper.
they all will stick together very good.

just try it out, you have nothing to loose. ;)

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Ben
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Re: Picture Discs Question

Post: # 45875Unread post Ben
Mon Jan 30, 2017 6:19 pm

Thanks a lot for your precious advices :)

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SUNBEARS
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Re: Picture Discs Question

Post: # 45896Unread post SUNBEARS
Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:28 pm

Hey brother! I had great success making picture discs.

Here is one that I made for my band a couple years ago.
https://youtu.be/SWQ5TsuraF4

However, I did a few things differently. I don't use Souri's stock. I have a print guy here in Jacksonville that does all my printing for labels, jackets, etc, and he printed up my artwork for the picture discs and die cut them into circles for me. Everything was super sharp and super centered.

I also bought a different laminator. I used this, set to 300 degrees Fahrenheit.

https://www.amazon.com/Apache-AL18P-18-Professional-Laminator/dp/B0012UKI72/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1485919272&sr=8-1-fkmr0&keywords=Apache+AL13P+Professional

1. Print your art and die cut and trim to size of your picture disc blanks. Mine are printed on starboard tack stock.

2. Peel off the protective layer of the sticky side of your picture disc blank.

3. Place your printed art face up on a turn table then place your picture disc blank sticky side down.

4. Run blank through laminator set at 300 degrees. Do this for every piece.

Now you are ready to cut!

5. Remove protective layer from cutting side and cut your side A or B.

6. Once you have cut a blank for each side of the picture disc, you can then remove the protect layers on the sticky part of the Starboard Tack.

7. Place one blank sticky side up on a turntable and the other side on top, stick side down.

Should be kick-ass now!

Have fun!

Cheers,
J
The loudness war is over, if you want it! - http://www.berlinmastering.co

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Ben
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Re: Picture Discs Question

Post: # 45902Unread post Ben
Wed Feb 01, 2017 10:24 am

Hey J
Thanks so much for this, your purple picture disc is amazing... wow!!

Quick question what exactly is starboard tack stock ?

Cheers and thanks for all the steps... you rock brother!! I really appreciate that !

Ben

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Ben
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Re: Picture Discs Question

Post: # 46209Unread post Ben
Fri Feb 24, 2017 3:12 pm

Hey Guys,

I tried the print on vinyl paper (avery deninson) gloss or matte..... problem is there's a lot of bubble... I can't seem to figure out what to do.
My laminator is almost at 300 ... it even got a little too hot that it changed the texture of the plastic.... I turned it down a little... around 285- 290 F

I''ve attached some pics.... maybe you can help me a bit.
Thanks a lot
File_003.jpeg
File_002.jpeg
File_001.jpeg
File_000.jpeg
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sat159p1
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Re: VinylRecorder Picture Discs Question

Post: # 46222Unread post sat159p1
Sat Feb 25, 2017 3:29 pm

SUNBEARS, how you glue your printed art to the blank discs?

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Ben
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Re: VinylRecorder Picture Discs Question

Post: # 46223Unread post Ben
Sat Feb 25, 2017 6:34 pm

If he uses Souri's discs like I do..... they are 2 x 1mm adhesive clear discs.
I tried the 3m 77 spray glue on a normal vinyl... but it left a lot of residue and it was not transparent anymore.

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Vice Fiori
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Re: VinylRecorder Picture Discs Question

Post: # 49739Unread post Vice Fiori
Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:44 pm

I'm late, but here we go...

I never know about souris picture disc kit, i only knowing about it now.
So try to research by myself about 2 years how i can make my pictures, it took so much time and head that i got almost crazy.. haha

First, I want to make a real piece or art on vinyl, with light reflects and things like this, so i recover to use an optical and expensive material...
As I make my oun records (transparent black, green and clear) i think "why not pictures?"

From start, i think "how it can be possible find some damn paper with dual side and photo quallity, to put optic foil in both sides and then glue on each blank?
then i try to make something direct from blank, and get my expensive and desastrous thing, as you said ben, with so much bubbles and errors..

so i start to think becaus, the best way is use the glued face of optic foil first on paper, and than put on hard surface blank, or you'll start to get in trouble because almost part of it going to get you bubbles BUT i cant do this in double sided print material because when i glue one side on hard surface (side A) i had a entire hard glued surface to put the second hard side (B).

So i have a idea: use vinyl paper high wuallity print with a print side and a sticky side, print 2 of then (side A and side B), put the opto glass foil on each printed picture paper part, glue each foil on each hard surface (blank) take of the sticky part of each part and glue using the turntable to align.. magic done: no bubbles, and a amazing 210g art picture disc what i distribute in a special frame wall with lock and grave metal....

IMPORTANT: I make by hand, get SO MUCH, SO SO MUCH WORK to not get bubbles, because this special opto adhesive is REALLY sensible, and also this kind of similar adhesive are too sensible and you had to make it slow, NEVER put the entire photo paper glued on this kind of plastic adhesives or you'll get great bubbles whatever reason you try, aways start centering everything, hold tight everything, pull off just a little sticky part, glue this little part on paper so you're get more free to start to pull out the rest of the protection and start to come slowly and gluing with care.

Im afraid to use normal laminators because this kind of works and plastic adhesive sheets not work well with hot things, even your blank can get trouble, so i recommend a cold silicon laminator, i going to get one, but now i making by hand, a manual cold laminator can help with the job because you have much more control, a fast one you cant get back, only can go ahead, so if you not center the things right, you can get in trouble hard, my material is coast, so i really need to take care with
...
Some pictures about what I do and going to do, i think picture discs can be special, so i aways povide a single and only picture on front and other side with the texts, because, come on, i think it's terrible for exemplo, that picture discs that looks like the front album paper cover, burned, with so much name and things:
planet.jpg
.............
*Trevor something:
trevor4.jpg
trevor2.jpg
trevor6.jpg
trevor5.jpg
trevor1.jpg
trevor3.jpg
......

Some work im making for some (I think) Special people:

*Bioshock infinite soundtrack:
bioshock.jpg
.............

*Macintosh Plus:
macintoshplus.jpg
..............

*DOOM (2016) soundtrack:
doom.jpg
..............

*Blood (game by monolith) soundtrack:
blood.jpg
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Last edited by Vice Fiori on Sun Mar 18, 2018 1:08 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Vice Fiori
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Re: Picture Discs Question

Post: # 49740Unread post Vice Fiori
Sun Mar 18, 2018 1:02 pm

SUNBEARS wrote:Hey brother! I had great success making picture discs.

Here is one that I made for my band a couple years ago.
https://youtu.be/SWQ5TsuraF4

However, I did a few things differently. I don't use Souri's stock. I have a print guy here in Jacksonville that does all my printing for labels, jackets, etc, and he printed up my artwork for the picture discs and die cut them into circles for me. Everything was super sharp and super centered.

I also bought a different laminator. I used this, set to 300 degrees Fahrenheit.

https://www.amazon.com/Apache-AL18P-18-Professional-Laminator/dp/B0012UKI72/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1485919272&sr=8-1-fkmr0&keywords=Apache+AL13P+Professional

1. Print your art and die cut and trim to size of your picture disc blanks. Mine are printed on starboard tack stock.

2. Peel off the protective layer of the sticky side of your picture disc blank.

3. Place your printed art face up on a turn table then place your picture disc blank sticky side down.

4. Run blank through laminator set at 300 degrees. Do this for every piece.

Now you are ready to cut!

5. Remove protective layer from cutting side and cut your side A or B.

6. Once you have cut a blank for each side of the picture disc, you can then remove the protect layers on the sticky part of the Starboard Tack.

7. Place one blank sticky side up on a turntable and the other side on top, stick side down.

Should be kick-ass now!

Have fun!

Cheers,
J
MAN WHAT A PIECE OF WORK :D

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ilium
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Re: Picture Discs Question

Post: # 49779Unread post ilium
Tue Mar 20, 2018 8:51 am

SUNBEARS wrote:I don't use Souri's stock.

2. Peel off the protective layer of the sticky side of your picture disc blank.
What adhesive stock did you use for the blanks?

BTW. I had some picture discs made by duplication.ca and they used spray adhesive .. I was not happy with the results

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Vice Fiori
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Re: Picture Discs Question

Post: # 49827Unread post Vice Fiori
Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:57 pm

ilium wrote:
SUNBEARS wrote:I don't use Souri's stock.

2. Peel off the protective layer of the sticky side of your picture disc blank.
What adhesive stock did you use for the blanks?

BTW. I had some picture discs made by duplication.ca and they used spray adhesive .. I was not happy with the results

can you tell (show) why? i never see anything from duplication, through they make a press one

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ilium
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Re: Picture Discs Question

Post: # 49853Unread post ilium
Fri Mar 23, 2018 9:38 pm

Vice Fiori wrote: can you tell (show) why? i never see anything from duplication, through they make a press one
Ben wrote: I tried the 3m 77 spray glue on a normal vinyl... but it left a lot of residue and it was not transparent anymore.
Similar problems as what Ben described.. fogging, visible spots of adhesive.. the first batch I got from them had pieces of plant material stuck under the plastic from I guess doing the spraying out doors??? Also I guess they glue the pieces together and then use a router to cut the circle which left the paper jagged in some places and created a lot of paper dust that got stuck under the plastic. I eventually got them to rerecord my order without using the router and I cut them by hand with scissors .. although there were still issues with the spray adhesive being spotty.

FYI they are using a presto 8D-G with an upgraded Grampian feedback head and Gotham amp for cutting

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Vice Fiori
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Re: VinylRecorder Picture Discs Question

Post: # 49859Unread post Vice Fiori
Sat Mar 24, 2018 12:39 pm

not good, i let the paper and adhevisve with space and use a ready blank then i finalize with sharp knife, this days i even do the cut first to make sure that i not going to have problem with the cut or liquid material and finish make the picture to not lost the adhesive

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ilium
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Re: VinylRecorder Picture Discs Question

Post: # 49860Unread post ilium
Sat Mar 24, 2018 1:38 pm

Vice Fiori wrote:not good, i let the paper and adhevisve with space and use a ready blank then i finalize with sharp knife, this days i even do the cut first to make sure that i not going to have problem with the cut or liquid material and finish make the picture to not lost the adhesive
I wasn't expecting perfection and know very well it's a "handmade" process but there just seemed to be alot of avoidable sloppy workmanship.. at any rate I'm looking for a better solution I can do myself.

Still looking to get a lead on a US source for adhesive backed material to make blanks from.

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Vice Fiori
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Re: VinylRecorder Picture Discs Question

Post: # 49861Unread post Vice Fiori
Sat Mar 24, 2018 4:24 pm

well, did you see my picture discs? it's totally handmade from scratch and by hand, dont look so bad as you mention and paid for it.

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ilium
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Re: VinylRecorder Picture Discs Question

Post: # 49862Unread post ilium
Sat Mar 24, 2018 6:29 pm

Vice Fiori wrote:well, did you see my picture discs? it's totally handmade from scratch and by hand, dont look so bad as you mention and paid for it.
Yeah I read your description of your process above. It's still unclear to me exactly what materials you are using. If I understand your process you are making a double sided print, then using an "optical adhesive" to attach the clear record blank to each side?

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Vice Fiori
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Re: VinylRecorder Picture Discs Question

Post: # 49871Unread post Vice Fiori
Sun Mar 25, 2018 2:27 pm

ilium wrote:
Vice Fiori wrote:well, did you see my picture discs? it's totally handmade from scratch and by hand, dont look so bad as you mention and paid for it.
Yeah I read your description of your process above. It's still unclear to me exactly what materials you are using. If I understand your process you are making a double sided print, then using an "optical adhesive" to attach the clear record blank to each side?
1-printing a quality adhesive paper
2-putting the opto adhesive on print side of paper
3-removing the other sticky side of opto and put on blank

this is the side A, do the same thing from side B and:

1-cut the rest of adhesive and paper with a sharp knife (i aways do some more paper and adhesive to get better job
2-remove the stick from print paper back side A and B
3-put one side down on turntable, then put the other side to glue each sticky back parts (if can, do a little curve on the disc you're going to glue on another disc, to start from center and corners and then gently going uncurve to glue it slow on all disc
4-if you have and can, use a cold laminator to finish all glue parts and get it mor sticked, cold laminator is great too to avoid bubbles on adhesives and get a better service, i do it by hand, but it's a real work to do..

i said it because, dont want to say bad about that guys, but what you said about their work and finish product, i dont see excuses to not do a better job, even by hand you know?
glue parts? ok, but, plants? dusts? bad shape papers? i dont think so, as you said, something like slopy and fast work, i take hours by hand and tipe by laminator, but noone want a nasty job

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ilium
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Re: VinylRecorder Picture Discs Question

Post: # 49872Unread post ilium
Sun Mar 25, 2018 3:02 pm

Vice Fiori wrote:2-putting the opto adhesive on print side of paper
Is this a product that can be bought online? I did some searches for optical adhesive and didn't really come up with anything, thanks

Vice Fiori wrote:i said it because, dont want to say bad about that guys, but what you said about their work and finish product, i dont see excuses to not do a better job, even by hand you know? glue parts? ok, but, plants? dusts? bad shape papers? i dont think so, as you said, something like slopy and fast work, i take hours by hand and tipe by laminator, but noone want a nasty job
Yeah at first they were refusing to fix or give refund because of it being "handmade". Anyway that experience is what lead me to buy a lathe and do it myself.. lol!

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